145 - Frank Griffel on al-Ghazālī

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Why did al-Ghazālī judge "the philosophers" to be apostates? Peter finds out from Frank Griffel.

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Further Reading

• F. Griffel, Toleranz und Apostasie im Islam (Leiden: 2000).

• F. Griffel, “Al-Ghazālī’s Concept of Prophecy: the Introduction of Avicennan Psychology into Ashʿarite Theology,” Arabic Sciences and Philosophy 14 (2004), 101-44.

• F. Griffel, “Taqlīd of the Philosophers: al-Ghazālī’s Initial Accusation in the Tahāfut,” in Ideas, Images, and Methods of Portrayal, ed. S. Günther (Leiden: 2005), 273-96.

• F. Griffel, “MS London, British Library Or. 3126: an Unknown Work by al-Ghazālī on Metaphysics and Philosophical Theology,” Journal of Islamic Studies 17 (2006), 1-42.

• F. Griffel, Al-Ghazālī’s Philosophical Theology (New York: 2009).

• F. Griffel, The Formation of Post-Classical Philosophy in Islam (Oxford: 2021).

Comments

Ahmed on 28 May 2014

Ghazali's influence

Sorry to bother you by posting on such an ancient podcast Peter, but I just stumbled across this one and I was really intrigued by what Frank Griffel said at the end about Al-Ghazali. Up till now I have only been aware of the general impression in the Western as well as the Muslim world that Al-Ghazali spelled in some sense the death of philosophy in the Eastern tradition at least. But Frank Griffel pointed out that among other things he helped bring philosophy out of just "falsafa" and into Kalam and Sufism. Is that a serious point to consider when considering Al-Ghazali-the-philosopher's legacy?

Thanks for the podcasts, great job!

In reply to by Ahmed

Peter Adamson on 28 May 2014

Ghazali's influence

Yes, I definitely agree with Frank about this. I think it is still debatable how pivotal Ghazali's role was in perpetuating philosophy but he certainly didn't kill it off in the East. Hence episode 171 onward, in which I am devoting something like 15-20 episodes to the supposedly non-existent later Easter tradition! But you are right that this is still a commonly held myth, which is why I am working so hard to dispel it.

In reply to by Peter Adamson

Ahmed on 28 May 2014

Al-Ghazali's influence

Thanks! And again thanks for the podcasts, many of us have started following them almost religiously!

Arslan Akhtar on 31 May 2014

Hello sir, First of all, I

Hello sir,

First of all, I want to thank you for such initiative ; the "without any gaps" particularly take a new level as, indeed, al-Ghazali has been seen as the one who buried (some would like to say crucified) philosophy, if not "rational thought", in the lands of Islam - contemporary academics who specialize in the "Hujjat al Islam", amongst whom Frank Griffel is an eloquent representative, have shown that the truth is far from that : not only al Ghazali did not destroy philosophical speculation in Islam, but he, with the later help of Fakhr al Din al Razi, literally "ortodhoxoized" it (and Sufism too), so that, until the late 19th century, even your average "mullah" used Aristotelian logic... and it still happens in the Shia world !

So, and as you mention post-classical (or post-Ghazalian...) philosophical tradition, I wonder if there's a project of doing something with Robert Wisnovsky (McGill university), that I know you're aware of from a previous commentary (but don't think have been podcasts of yet) ?

Thanks again !

In reply to by Arslan Akhtar

Peter Adamson on 1 June 2014

Wisnovsky

Ask and you shall receive! As it happens I already did an interview with Wisnovsky, it will be up in about a month.

And of course you know I agree with you about the Ghazali myth.

Thanks!

Peter

No Skipping on 30 December 2015

A great podcast

As I'm not much interested in religion, it was tempting to skip the episodes on early Christianity and Islam. That's despite the premise of the podcast being "no gaps". I'm so glad I gave them a go.

A lot of the material on free will, necessity, eternity and God's foreknowledge was well worth listening to. The podcast also raised a few questions I hadn't considered before. Why do Christians need Jesus to be divine and not just a guide who can show us the right way to live? How do Muslims justify God sending several prophets, knowing this would cause conflict between their different followers?

Another benefit of the podcast is that it serves as a good history lesson. I've picked up a fair bit about Greece and Rome in previous episodes. In the past I've learnt the history of the Sunni and the Shia three or four times, now it might finally stick.

I've posted this before and will probably post this again: a great podcast.

In reply to by No Skipping

Peter Adamson on 2 January 2016

No skipping

Thanks very much! So glad you like the podcast. And I'm especially glad the material on the Abrahamic traditions managed to overcome your initial skepticism, I tried hard to make them interesting to a non-religious as well as religious audience (same with the current series on medieval).

Shwan on 1 April 2020

Good podcast

Sorry to bother, but isn’t that title misleading?! As Ghazali only targeted neoplatonists here.

In reply to by Shwan

Peter Adamson on 2 April 2020

Misleading title?

Do you mean the title of Ghazali's book, "Incoherence of the Philosophers"? You are right, it seems to be sort of misleading because he is attacking, actually, not "Neoplatonists" but very specifically Avicenna. However as Griffel has argued elsewhere this is really evidence that the word "philosophers (falāsifa)" in Arabic, starting around this time, means "Avicennans." If they want to say "philosophers" in a broader sense they might instead use a different word that roughly means "wise people" (from ḥikma, "wisdom," rather than falsafa which clearly comes from the greek word philosophia). So I think that Ghazali's audience would not have been misled and certainly his target is made abundantly clear in the book itself.

Leonellus on 2 November 2023

Omar Khayyam and Abdul Latif Al Baghdadi

Hi professor Peter, i read your comment and definitely your podcast that from eps 170 onwards you are discussing the philosophers in the eastern side tradition flourishing even after Al Ghazali attacks (most notably against avicennism) to debunk the myth of he hindered the philosophical tradition in the Islamicate world

 

I also found one of your interview earlier this year on YouTube discussing Islamic philosophy where you also showed the list of philosophers lived during the golden age of Islam but i did not find Omar Khayyam (which lived on the sa e era as Ghazali (and if i am not mistaken Ghazali wrote a commentary on his poem?)) and Abd Al Latif Al Baghdadi (which lived just after Al Razi and before the destrction of Baghdad by the Mongols) made it on the list which i consider them to be one of the great figures aswell.

 

I am curious what is your take on them and is there any professor that is currently studying their works and possible material for further readings?

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